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Saadia and Kematu will probably have escaped by then so go ahead and kill both to be safe... @Grok Not sure if the Justiciars are related to that choice. You can complete this mission in two ways. I doubt that 21 year is enough to clear up all the bad blood between the altmer and the redguards especially with the redguards being involved in gibbeting one of their more famous generals. Games. Recently added 26 View all 1,181. Well it's certainly possible... but less likely than the game bugging due to Saadia being removed from the game and adding remains in the Hall as if she'd been killed. videogame_asset My games. As Thane of Whiterun, it is the dragonborn's duty to eliminate the Alik'r for their continued activities against Whiterun hold. Tired of wandering and tired of fame. In the end, the main Aldmeri army in Cyrodiil was completely destroyed. Yeah, I'm on Saadia's side, the other thing that made me want to believe her is that if she helped the Aldmeri Dominion she could be fine under their protection, they're pretty freaking strong that and the fact she was a noble and became a tavern wench to live in hiding rather than staying a noble gives some credibility to her defense. The purpose of this quest I think is to make you question which is the right option to take. But I'd rather stand with truth than money (I don't really need the 500g that bad... plenty of money later on). The man you can free from jail seems strangely honourable, saying he has shamed his companions and wants to begin anew. For The Elder Scrolls V: Skyrim on the Xbox 360, a GameFAQs message board topic titled "In my time of need quest, who is telling the truth? Saadia or Kematu? As far as I know, Skyrim doesn't go into detail about the Alik'r. Saadia's burial urn seems (to me) to be clear evidence that she was murdered within Skyrim. Kematu asks you to meet him in Rorikstead. Saadia is a citizen of Skyrim and Whiterun, so as a thane of Whiterun hold, Saadia is under my protection. Although not explicitly mentioned, judging by the White-Gold Concordat I doubt that the treaty of Stros M'kai left the Aldmeri Dominion empty handed (which might explain Kematu saying that the resistance in Hammerfell is still ongoing). [...] Hammerfell, however, refused to accept the White-Gold Concordat, being unwilling to concede defeat and the loss of so much of their territory. [...] One army, with the legions from Hammerfell under General Decianus, was hidden in the Colovian Highlands near Chorrol. Meanwhile Saadia's burial urn, which appears in Whiterun afterwards, could have been sent back for whatever reason (e.g., they didn't want the traitor buried in her ancestral home). The Aldmeri have always been able to win fights without the assistance of individuals, especially noble women, who may or may not have access to military secrets. So we all know this quest by now: you have to pick whether to side with Saadia or Kematu. http://elderscrolls.wikia.com/wiki/In_My_Time_of_Need. You won't find any hints pointing to which side is telling the truth - you need to trust your intuition. Unwilling to abandon Hammerfell completely, he allowed a great number of "invalids" to be discharged from the Legions before they marched east. Mods. Lord Naarifin was kept alive for thirty-three days, hanging from the White-Gold tower. Saadia's story had a lot of inconsistencies and I mean a lot. Saadia is wanted by the noble houses of Taneth for treason. They can be right but it's disrespectful. After 20 years of AES, what the retrospective changes that should have been made? Saadia is known for constantly changing her name. According to the book on The Great War the Alik'r Warriors inflected massive casualties on the Dominion armies. That's pretty compelling evidence against them in my book. Who's telling the truth? I would rather base my theory on what happens in-game, as part of the quest, and draw logical conclusions from that. 3) I walk around in a full suit of armor made from the scales of a dragon with daedric weapons.... Perspective? Meaning she was killed, and suggesting that Saadia was telling the truth: Kematu and his men were in the employ of the Dominion all along. For the following reasons I choose to side with Kematu: 1. that Kematu might have been telling the truth and that Saadia truly was a Given that Hammerfell is not friendly with the Thalmor, Saadia's story of being persecuted for speaking out against them seems unlikely. #5, note that Kematu clearly has the apparent advantage in numbers when he makes the proposal, and he's taking a risk that you double-cross him by pretending to accept the proposal and then help Saadia escape (or kill Kematu at the exchange, which you can actually do). From reading the lore, Hammerfell resisted the Thalmore and the Empire distanced themselves from Hammerfell. She has every reason to exaggerate and obfuscate, and I can't really blame her for it. I ignored them - my quest is to find the truth in Skyrim, not some runaway slave. And as stated, the Thalmor don't have the right to just kidnap people in Skyrim, they would have to hire someone else to capture her. site design / logo © 2021 Stack Exchange Inc; user contributions licensed under cc by-sa. Surviving the journey from Hammerfell to Skyrim was probably not easy, especially for a pampered noble. This is why I believe Saadia. Saadia claims that she's innocent, that Kematu and his men are mercenaries hired by the Dominion to kill her. If a jet engine is bolted to the equator, does the Earth speed up? Kematu and his mercenaries are definitely the ones telling the truth. She could have a trial under a partial judge. The Emperor's decision to withdraw from the Imperial City in 4E 174 was bloodily vindicated. I don't think that she was taken back to Hammerfell, executed, and then returned to Skyrim for burial. She says that she spoke out against the Thalmor in Hammerfell and they hired assassins to hunt her down. The premise is to add "romance" to the game, with the new dialogues leading to sidequests allowing the seduction of the many citizens of Skyrim. If you side with Kematu, he claims he'll be taking Saadia to Hammerfell to stand trial, that she won't be harmed "until she gets there". Kematu keeps his word about taking Saadia alive. Kematu's explanation that she betrayed a city to … 2. votes. Pulling a knife is what anyone would do. The Alik'r are hiding in a damn bandit cave 5. Elder Scrolls is a FANDOM Games Community. it appears so. Kematu, on the other hand, is a calculating liar. Saadia seems hesitant to explain the full situation, while Kematu elaborates on it fully. The game doesn't tell us who is right here, so we're stuck with the dilemma people face in real life: we have to make the best choice with the information we have. Kematu just threatens you with his band of assassins and hopes you'll lead him to her because he knows that you know where she is at that point. And we know (or at least, I believe) that Kematu has already lied to us. Kematu might be telling the truth. Once you find them, fast travel there and go tell the warrior where Saadia is at. Prior to her arrival in Skyrim, Saadia, or "Iman" to use her true name, as revealed during her quest, was a noble belonging to one of the most powerful houses in Hammerfell. If Saadia is a Thalmor agent why would she flee to Skyrim? The rest of your points make a lot of sense though. they have been causing trouble in Whiterun, to the point of getting thrown out and/or arrested, the Alik'r out searching refuse to give any reasons for hunting Saadia, they don't have any sort of official documentation of their hunt, they have been harassing Redguard women who are travelling throughout Skyrim, Saadia actually puts the weapon away when you ask her to. minecraft-java-edition the-elder-scrolls-v-skyrim minecraft-commands diablo-3 steam league-of-legends technical-issues pokemon-go minecraft-bedrock-edition starcraft-2 more tags. I think there are so many possible explanations for her death that it's impossible to draw safe conclusions from the sheer observation of a named urn in a crypt. via nexus mods. 2) They stand down and parlay if you start attacking their outpost. While this may seem like an act of desperate defiance, it may hint at a violent and unpredictable personality. We don't even know either of them are telling the truth. Although they are allowed to hunt down worshippers of Talos, they do not hold any authority to enforce local laws or their own in Skyrim. Complete with fake ashes in the urn (since if you search it you find "Saadia's Ashes" in the urn)? Was he in the employ of the Dominion? 2. She was supposed to be taken back alive for a trial. Browse all chevron_right; – Arkku Nov 30 '15 at 9:49. So I think it is reasonable to believe that Kematu was lying about his intentions to the Dragonborn. After a bit they disappear, and that's seemingly the end of it. What does children mean in “Familiarity breeds contempt - and children.“? In My Time of Need: Saadia was telling the truth. Okay, here's the facts: Whiterun kicked out Kematu's boys and imprisoned one of their members. It was mentioned that Saadia must be more than she claims to be, too. I'm pretty sure that this quest was intended to be ambiguous by Bethesda, but that doesn't mean it isn't entertaining to theorize about what was happening behind the scenes. I doubt it. "The Great War" chronicle accurately depicts the events that unfolded during the war between the empire and the Aldmeri dominion. If you accept Kematu's request and help him capture Saadia, you may We learn that the Redguards refuse to accept the treaty (and are expelled from the empire) and continue to wage war with the Aldmeri Dominion. Source: http://elderscrolls.wikia.com/wiki/In_My_Time_of_Need. Little does he know that his first step over the border is just the first step in the journey that will take him to his destiny and beyond. Swords. What is the highest road in the world that is accessible by conventional vehicles? Since Aldmeri Dominion justiciar parties are freely roaming throughout Skyrim (prisoners in tow), hiring a third party to do the same job seems questionable. Just found this out and felt like pointing it out here. Titus II was forced to officially renounce Hammerfell as an Imperial province in order to preserve the hard-won peace treaty. I wonder why no-one so far mentions the fact that she will attack you if you go along with her to "speak in private"? How can a GM subtly guide characters into making campaign-specific character choices? Saadia is wanted by the noble houses of Taneth for treason. So to break it down, Kematu's Alik'r are mercenaries that made 2 groups feel threatened, they were most likely hired by the Thalmor to capture Saadia and bring her back, and Kematu lies to you out of desperation in the cave, after you've destroyed his forces. Photochemical reduction of benzophenone: why inverted flask? Kematu's story is clear and detailed, while Saadia's is not. Empire and the Aldmeri Dominion signed the White-Gold Concordat, ending the Great War. Arqade is a question and answer site for passionate videogamers on all platforms. Saadia is known for constantly changing her name. Elder Scrolls and Fallout community: character builds, lore, discussions and more. She could be easily protected elsewhere. How can I visit HTTPS websites in old web browsers? Ragnthor of the Isles comes home to Skyrim after being gone for 8 years. If you side with Saadia during her questline, you may obtain proof of her innocence, and she will become available as a potential Follower, Steward, Spouse, and Traveling Merchant. What are the degrees of a pentatonic scale called? Her very life depends on convincing this random adventurer to protect her against a band of trained killers. Im not sure why ya'll think Saadia is the one in the wrong here. It is more likely that an individual spoke out against an organization rather than one individual causing the fall of Taneth. "I am a noble of House Suda in Hammerfell.". 1. answer. After Hammerfall itself its the province where accusations of Thalmor sympathy are most likely to get you lynched. The first time you talk to Saadia, she pulls a knife on you. If she was executed as a traitor, her (noble?) @Arkku Why, after an execution in Hammerfell, would they send her ashes back to Skyrim? They said there was a bounty on her head, and I would be rewarded for finding her. Why does she want that? When Kematu came to Whiterun in search for her, he didn't use force or made a scene. He also mentions justice, and taking her into custody, and implies that Saadia will face a trial back in Hammerfell rather than swift execution. According to her, when the Aldmeri Dominion spread to her province, she spoke out against the Dominion and was forced to leave the land. After completing the quest, Saadia seemed a bit, for lack of a better word, cold-hearted. rev 2021.1.18.38333, The best answers are voted up and rise to the top, Arqade works best with JavaScript enabled, Start here for a quick overview of the site, Detailed answers to any questions you might have, Discuss the workings and policies of this site, Learn more about Stack Overflow the company, Learn more about hiring developers or posting ads with us. Skyrim Main Quest; Eventual Romance; Summary. All this points to him and his warriors being enforcers rather than assassins. @Andy_Vulhop 1) This logic doesnt hold up with any other AI in the game. On the other hand, were they killed by 'regular' murderers this wouldn't enrage you politically. According to claims, Saadia was forced to flee the province to Skyrim after speaking out against the Aldmeri Dominion , … Active 1 Bountied Hot Week Month. Just looking at what they were packing - they had curved swords. That would mean she didn't die in skyrim and that Kematu didn't lie. Just found this out and felt like pointing it out here. So no, I don't think it is improbable that a desperate noblewoman could survive the journey. Do the Alik'r actually go after you if you take too long to lure Saadia to the stables? because of the assault on the Thalmor Embassy in the main questline). If you believe Saadia, skip to Talk to the Alik'r Prisoner. If she was executed as a traitor, her (noble?) Once Saadia is alone with the Dragonborn, she will explain her side of the situation. However, you must consider that the Alik'r have curved swords. Stack Exchange network consists of 176 Q&A communities including Stack Overflow, the largest, most trusted online community for developers to learn, share their knowledge, and build their careers. Whiterun isn't a pro-Imperial city, at present its neutral. Schaken-Mods EXCLUSIVE! An additional point in favour of Kematu is that if you kill Saadia at the exchange, he laments the wasted effort, so clearly he wasn't just planning on murdering her once they're out of your sight. I'm sure she's lying, too. Take your favorite fandoms with you and never miss a beat. chevron_right. Were it not for her betrayal, Taneth could have held its ground in the war." You might argue that the Urn's placement is symbolic, or that she was killed by a random monster while being escorted away, but both possibilities require a great deal of supposition. Draevan, and what do you have to say about the hypothesis of the urn being symbolic, since they simply don't find her the next morning? Speaking to the Alik'r ends the quests and earns the reward. traitor (source needed, Justiciar Execution Orders are normally issued Just to be clear, by that you mean the people of Whiterun woke up, saw she was gone, assumed she was dead and held a funeral? These veterans formed the core of the army that eventually drove Lady Arannelya's forces back across the Alik'r late in 174, taking heavy losses on their retreat from harassing attacks by the Alik'r warriors. It only takes a minute to sign up. At least until he was away from the city, to avoid more trouble with the Whiterun guards. 2) Same 3-4) Kematu doesn't have to. We learn that the Aldmeri Dominion were eventually forced to widthdraw from Hammerfell as the war lead to a standstill. What's the point of telling your Companion to sleep? So are they loyal agents of Hammerfell? In 4E 175 the White-Gold Concordat is signed. Anyone that bases their point solely on another person being a liar, well that's just very dodgy straight off the bat. @omikron yes, but then why would her burial urn be in Whiterun? @Andy_Vulhop Using the official means to complete every and any task is stupid for every great empire, especially if it concerns breaking in another Hold to make justice as they understand it. We learn that Lord Naarifin a general of the Aldmeri Dominion was gibbeted at the end of the retaking of the Imperial City. She is alone, friendless, and has just learned that her pursues have caught up with her. @Flater re. In the end, the heroic Redguards fought the Aldmeri Dominion to a standstill, [...] to allow the eventually Second Treaty of Stros M'kai in 4E 180 and the withdrawal of Aldmeri forces from Hammerfell. He didn't kill her but she wants you to kill them. Saadia specifically wants you go and kill Kematu. Trying a bit an experiment this month - with a poll that posits a moral dilemma from Elder Scrolls. If she had caused the downfall of Taneth, why would she hide outside of Aldmeri territory? If you prefer to side with the Redguards, skip to Inform the Alik'r of Saadia's location. If you go and check in Whiterun's Hall of the Dead shortly after, you find Saadia's burial urn. We learn that General Decianus left some troops behind referred to in the book as "Alik'r warriors" who kept battling the Aldmeri Dominion when Decianus had to heed the call of emperor Titus Mede II to march to Cyrodiil. IMO her crime isn't worth following her all over the world for in the first place and I doubt she'd do anything in the future to further increase people's urge to kill her... Add the fact that she is now in Skyrim where the Thalmor can easily keep an eye on her if they feel the need to. Side with the Alik'r and Saadia will be executed. So, yeah. I doubt that Rorik (having fought against the Aldmeri Dominion) would let them stay in his town if he had any suspicions about them making deals with the Thalmor. Partly because she didn't hold any particular attachment to the place (she has no friends or family tagged, if you look her up in the Creation Kit), and its doubtful that the Redguards would show her the respect of a proper burial. Punishment for treason is death, so it proves nothing. 9 Was Saadia Telling The Truth, Or Was Kematu? Keep in mind the Aldmeri agreed to sign a peace treaty that is of great advantage but doesn't grant unlimited powers. and wanting to see the girl he left behind. close. @Andy_Vulhop The Aldmeri never imposed their judicial system to the defeated Holds. I just kill both sides, sometimes for sh#$s and giggles, other times for maximum reward. Why Is Jarl Balgruuf Essential? Furthermore, they have already been instructed to cease their activities. Saadia wouldn't be hiding in Skyrim if she was really fleeing from the Thalmor. Bash - How to reorganize files based on the dates in their names? family might not want her buried in her ancestral home. The Alik'r are not allowed in the city, so for now she is perfectly safe. NPC Replacer for Saadia, the Redguard woman located in the Bannered Mare. I'll say Kematu is the one to trust. The Alik'r are also ousted from entering Whiterun.. for some reason I would imagine. Maurice Jondrelle is an idiot who's going to get us both killed, Who's that in the wall in Reachcliff Cave. 1) Saadia is on her own, hiding and being hunted. As was mentioned, her story is fishy as hell. Rorik himself is an old war dog who fought in the Great War. This was my original reason to hit F9, say "screw you" and sold her out instead. My Conclusions - Feel free to make your own based on the given facts. Ultimately, my decision is to side against the Alik'r (note that is not the same thing as siding with Saadia): All of the hard evidence is against the Alik'r acting in an acceptable or legitimate fashion, with only Kematu's honeyed words suggesting otherwise. (spoilers)". Swords. Why is Steam telling me to buy a game I've already purchased? 1) You are obviously far more than she can handle, so it's in her best interests to yield. The Alik'r pretty much are going to kill you unless you give them Saadia. Kematu claims Saadia is the Dominion agent. Is Saadia… However after reading this I realised, if she has an Urn, with her name on it, it means she was officially/publically killed. Many inconsistencies. During the Companions questline the player gets to decide if they would like to become a werewolf. You guys are being to obsessed with this thing... She is a waitress now, nothing of interest anymore. Makes sense to me. encounter a group of Thalmor Justiciars in the wild that carry a In Whiterun, or anywhere else in Skyrim, this is the lore and the law. Textbook recommendation for multiple traveling salesman problem transformation to standard TSP. @James If your counter to my first argument is that the same logic has never applied in the in-game AI, then you can't suggest that killing a large portion of a group convinced them to parlay, as that never happens with in-game AI. I side with Kematu, because I probably can't take on 20 assassins with curved swords. I tend to believe Kematu as well, mostly for the reasons you outlined. However, let’s look at some facts. She probably fled Hammerfell with some valuables, and traded them to mercenaries and caravans to acquire safe passage across Tamriel. The player cannot be… Skyrim. I just happened to visit the hall of the dead in white run, after helping the Alik'r and what do I find Saadia's burial Urn. The problem is that there's really no way to tell which one is telling the truth. They are hardly savage bandits. Wishing I hadn't turned her over, but oh well, I don't know if I could have beaten that many Alik'r warriors anyway. When logged in, you can choose up to 12 games that will be displayed as favourites in this menu. We're all, I am sure, VERY familiar with the Whiterun quest 'In my time of need' - where you are faced with deciding whether Saadia or Kematu are telling you the truth. Who must be present at the Presidential Inauguration? As Slade said here, her urn is in Whiterun, if you side with Kematu, meaning that while she might be taken back alive, she gets an execution at some point. The Aldmeri Dominion is currently in power in Hammerfell. Curved. Why not in Hammerfell? Both Kematu and Saadia are lying to the Dragonborn, so why do I believe that she is innocent? Essential NPCs refer to characters that are unkillable until they are …
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